Comments on: The Malonic Ester and Acetoacetic Ester Synthesis https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/ Thu, 28 Sep 2023 05:32:09 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.6.2 By: Difference Between Acetylacetoacetic Ester and Malonic Ester – In4arts.com https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-673367 Thu, 28 Sep 2023 05:32:09 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-673367 […] Kiki, et al. “The Malonic Ester Synthesis.” Master Organic Chemistry, 4 Oct. 2019, Available here. 2. “Ethyl Acetoacetate.” Wikipedia, Wikimedia Foundation, 28 June 2019, Available here. 3. […]

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By: James Ashenhurst https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-635446 Tue, 16 Aug 2022 15:42:20 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-635446 In reply to ridings bald.

The malonate enolate is a much stronger base than the carbonyl carbon. Adding acid will just irreversibly protonate the enolate.

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By: James Ashenhurst https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-564450 Wed, 18 Sep 2019 21:15:06 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-564450 In reply to Michael.

Right. So the Gabriel would form a C-N bond, and then hydrolysis would lead to decarboxylation.
So ester –> carboxylic acid, and depending on choice of conditions (usually hydrazine) phthalimide —> amine.

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By: James Ashenhurst https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-563872 Thu, 12 Sep 2019 20:38:00 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-563872 In reply to Rana purna.

The longest carbon chain needs to be 5 carbons, and the “core” of malonic acid will only have 2 after decarboxylation, so you need to add 3 carbons (propyl) and also an ethyl group (2-ethyl) to complete the molecule.
Starting with malonic ester, first, alkylate with propyl bromide, then ethyl bromide, then hydrolyze and decarboxylate. The result is 2-ethylpentanoic acid.

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By: James Ashenhurst https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-562211 Fri, 30 Aug 2019 01:26:48 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-562211 In reply to RajendranManghat.

It has to do with how many C-H bonds on the central carbon of diethyl malonate have been replaced by C-C bonds. If one C-H has been replaced (e.g. with ethyl) that’s monosubstituted. If two have been replaced (e.g. with ethyl and 2-pentyl) that’s disubstituted ethyl.

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By: James Ashenhurst https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-555292 Wed, 15 May 2019 02:46:27 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-555292 In reply to Rebecca.

If it’s an alpha, beta unsaturated beta-keto ester, yes. of course, they are great substrates.

If you’re talking about just a beta keto ester… then perhaps you are aware that they exist in the enol form. It’s possible to do addition-elimination reactions if you convert the OH to O-Tf for example and add a good nucleophile (e.g. a dialkylcuprate) but now we are getting far beyond the scope of what’s generally covered in introductory organic chem.

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By: Rana purna https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-537379 Thu, 30 Aug 2018 14:54:51 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-537379 How can we synthesize the 2-ethylpentanoic acid from malonic ester?

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By: Jordan https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-534054 Thu, 14 Jun 2018 00:05:34 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-534054 My teacher has us use saponification instead of acidic hydroloysis of the ester (I believe because it is more efficient). If I use saponification, do I need to add a separate acid workup since it makes a carbolylate or can the decarboxylation occur directly after this step?

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By: Chris G. https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-531353 Sun, 22 Apr 2018 19:41:58 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-531353 Why is this reaction called a Malonic ester “synthesis”? We’re starting with a malonic ester and ending up with a carboxylic acid, we aren’t creating a malonic ester in the end.

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By: ridings bald https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/08/14/the-malonic-ester-synthesis/#comment-525424 Sat, 23 Dec 2017 00:07:40 +0000 https://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/?p=5491#comment-525424 Is a protonated carbonyl group a strong enough electrophilic center to accept the lone pair from the malonic enolate?

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